Board Thread:Wiki Running/@comment-3225604-20150125104941

It has come to my conclusion that this user should not be blocked indefinitely. I'm trying to justify my points. I hope you would understand my points, though I'm most likely to be bashed about.

About Darian's case:

There are two occasions where he has made some provoking comments. These two comments are "finally beat this INSANELY hard level and anyone who doesn't think this is INSANELY HARD is insane!!" and "This is beyond insanely hard and person who developed this level needs to be fired from King". Then, he is warned with "This coment (think this is INSANELY HARD is insane!!) was truly selfish and non-respectful. So, please, ahve respect to others and don't be selfish." After the comment "this is beyond insanely hard" is made, he is warned by "Please stop raging like anything on hard levels". He replied with "???? please make sense!". He is also warned on the same day by "No offense, Darian, but you seems spamming opposes on my comment according to your comment, right? Was it just because of your past comment on Level 751 page? If so, tell me. Also, you was insulting to the developers of CCS. If you want to flight with them, go to King.com and flight there, not here. If you don't accpet this, too bad. This is seriously getting irritating and annoying. Remember this is your last warning before getting blocked!". However, I can't see that Darian is spamming on Rose's suggestions. Much on the contrary, I can only see he has made 4 opposes of Roseturnip's suggestion under different levels: 526, 541, 542 and 543, all in Dreamworld version. Because of that, Darian replied "So I don't have a right to support or oppose people now? What is your problem with me expressing my opposition or support to people's comments just like you oppose and support a lot of people's comments?  Maybe I don't like when people get power to their head just because they have been given admin powers.  And no I wasn't insulting any developers of CC.  And yes I have written to King to express my displeasure as well.  Just leave me alone and I will leave you alone.  Thanks". Rose replied as "Oh okay, thanks for insulting me, Darian. I also hear you're being rude to everyone, especially Cjay, and a user reported me about your behavior. You wish no way to change your behavior on this wiki. Because of this, you're considered as detrimental users, and you're now blocked INDEFINITELY! PLEASE REMEMBER THAT WE DON'T NEED YOUR STUPID SOCKPUPPETS! YOU IDIOT COME HERE JUST TO INSULTING US! THIS BLOCK IS NOT HARSH AT ALL! I'VE HAVE BEEN GIVEN YOU SO MUCH WARNING!"

His permanent block came when Bumblebee said "Ive just been attacked by Darian fisher. Block him forever", which is approved by Rose and claimed it as a "detrimental user". Bumblebee also added that he once said "shut up idiot to me". Then, I discovered that this is a lie. First, there is nothing in the deletion log. Secondly, I cannot also see "this reply has been deleted" or other things like that. Thirdly, 4 question marks doesn't tell others to shut up. Finally, Darian never told anyone to shut up.

I'm not sure if he acts rudely on chat. Even so, he should only be blocked in chat rather than in mainspace because these two are two different platforms. We also have a separate system to block users from these two platforms. Remember the purpose of mainspace editing is to show your contribution to the wiki and knowledge to the game, while the requirement of chatting is to have good communication skills and politeness.

In this case, Darian should not be blocked indefinitely, or even he should not be even blocked.

First, in the comment "finally beat this INSANELY hard level and anyone who doesn't think this is INSANELY HARD is insane!!", the controversial word is "insane". However, "insane" doesn't always relate to insults. I'm going to use Oxford Dictionary to support my point:


 * 1) In a state of mind which prevents normal perception, behaviour, or social interaction; seriously mentally ill:
 * 2) (Of an action or quality) characterized or caused by madness:
 * 3) Extremely annoyed:
 * 4) Extremely foolish; irrational:
 * 5) informal, chiefly US Shocking; outrageous:
 * 6) Astonishingly good or impressive; amazing:

Well, let me delete the entries which Darian will not be referring to in his comment. Entry 1.1, 1.2 and 2 can be crossed out. If the meaning of insane is entry 1.1, the word must be used before an action or a quality. In his comment, there is no action or quality after the word. In sample sentences given by Oxford Dictionary, this use must be followed by a noun. For entry 1.2, this word should be used describing onself's condition, and it does not fulfill the logic. How can one be annoyed if one can pass the level easily? For entry 2, this word under this meaning cannot only be used to describe about people. It is usually used after or before a noun, often referring to the item or the number of items which somebody could not possibly achieve or expect.

The only entries which I consider as reasonable would be entry 1, 1.3 and 2.1. If we cannot figure out which entry he is talking about, we can't deduce that he must be really insulting people (moreover, insane is not as strong as psychopathic or mentally deranged). Although I will not disagree warning him to "respect others (the players who don't find it insanely hard)" and the warning is not overly sensitive, he isn't mentioning anyone in particular to be insane (this is a kind of criticism without mentioning one's name, which is very common in every aspect, especially politics, so does it mean the politicians should be deemed as "disrespectful"). It's also reasonable to warn him. With the above reasons, his comment is not extremely disrespectful and selfish, also given that he didn't give any bad remarks or force others to agree his opinion (even not selfish since everyone has the right to express their opinions and he does not suppress the right of expressing their own opinions). This means that he should not be blocked indefinitely.

In my honest opinion, if you say that his comment is extremely disrespectful and selfish, I would like to ask you, "Have you ever bullied or criticized anyone directly?" Clearly I don't think Darian's comment can rival with our direct accusations to people about their bad behaviors. Darian hence should not be blocked indefinitely.

Secondly, in this comment "This is beyond insanely hard and person who developed this level needs to be fired from King" I find it to be very normal. Like a football club page, if you see the football club is having a poor run, I guarantee you will see comments like "manager out", "fire the manager!". Sometimes this kind of criticism should be made in platforms with affiliation to the product but no affiliation to the maker. Sometimes you do it to the maker, you will be silenced or hated. Therefore, it's understandable that sometimes people would choose to comment the game on forums rather than filing a complaint in order to express anger, arouse attention, and avoid the maker's procrastinating their fixes. I'm not going to use an example related to politics. I somehow agree with Blueeighthnote that Darian is cursing the developers, but I don't think it is very cruel. Darian should mean that the game developers should be fired because they have made an insanely hard level which makes a lot of players rage and quit the game, which in turn gives the game less attention to the public and makes King.com blame the game developers of making the level and fire them in order to halt the decline of attention. The criticism is logical and rational, so saying that it is an insult would not be very appropriate, but still it is impolite. Yet, the degree of impoliteness doesn't make Darian deserve an infinite block.

Let me tell you, calling people's nicknames and demonizing people even though the people haven't done something very bad is already more serious than Darian's insult to developers. I mean there is a point to Darian's insult, but then trying to call people's nicknames and cursing with all your will without a valid reason that the person is doing a lot of harm to you is much more irrational. In this case, Darian should receive almost no blocking period.

Thirdly, he is told to "stop raging like anything on hard levels". Did he "rage"? Kind of. However, raging on hard levels is very common here. Have you ever raged on hard levels? I don't think anyone hasn't. By the way, his rage is not in full caps, foul language regardless of censored or uncensored, continuous insults or overuse of punctuation. Therefore, I don't see why he should calm down when he is not very angry. That makes Darian's reply very reasonable since I can't figure out why he needs to calm down. If he needs to calm down, then I suppose you are just trying to suppress people's opinion in different levels. And THEN, what goes very ridiculous is that he is slandered of "shutting people up". That's an unreasonable accusation. It's enough to call the accusation as slander since Darian NEVER EVER tells Bumblebee to shut up. No records of this kind of language in his contributions, or any deleted replies related to the thread or whatsoever (log). This is also proved with no words of "this reply has been removed" mentioned in the thread. I find this kind of accuse as framing others. I'm serious but claiming others doing this act without giving a proof is definitely not allowed. As I said before, if he has done that on chat, he should be blocked in chat rather than in mainspace since these two are different platforms and should not be treated in the same way as in two platforms. I'm literally infuriated when I can see an admin blocks him without trying to do some investigation about his actions, which results in a permanent block. This is no different to "blocking people by feelings" and the same as "groundless blocks" or "莫須有" in Chinese. Darian's action in replying with "???? please make sense!" definitely does not EVEN worth a block. Does Darian even attack you? No!

Finally, in Roseturnip's warning, Darian's reply is not even insulting in fact. Even in Roseturnip's warning, Darian did not even spam opposes in Roseturnip's comments. Come on! If you say that Darian is spamming opposes to Roseturnip, then why am I not spamming to Roseturnip's opinions because I don't agree with most of Roseturnip's suggestions? The main point is that EVERYONE has their right to express their opinions. Moreover, Darian is not spamming with dozens of opposes, so would you even say that Darian is spamming opposes when he only had made 4 opposes after the comment on level 751? Darian's questioning is appropriate. Even though he has made some rude comments in the past, you shouldn't even assume his opinions and comments after the comment on level 751 are all insults. Darian has not done any direct attack to Roseturnip, not even a single metaphoric criticism related to Roseturnip, so how on earth is he even insulting Roseturnip in first place? HOW??!!

Let me examine Rose's reply too, "Oh okay, thanks for insulting me, Darian. I also hear you're being rude to everyone, especially Cjay, and a user reported me about your behavior. You wish no way to change your behavior on this wiki. Because of this, you're considered as detrimental users, and you're now blocked INDEFINITELY!

PLEASE REMEMBER THAT WE DON'T NEED YOUR STUPID SOCKPUPPETS! YOU IDIOT COME HERE JUST TO INSULTING US! THIS BLOCK IS NOT HARSH AT ALL! I'VE HAVE BEEN GIVEN YOU SO MUCH WARNING!"

First of all, as I have said before, Darian's reply is not an insult. Darian hasn't made any offensive comments to Rose, not even a single comment to anyone. Darian's reply in this situation is already polite, given that "thanks" and "maybe" have been used. Darian is afraid that admins are going to suppress opinions because they are given the power to block users. Darian's worries are reasonable because he is considered to be spamming opposes even though he doesn't spam any in fact. Rather than blocking the user, should you try to resolve Darian's worries instead?

Secondly, he is not rude to everyone, given that he does not attack everyone he sees. That is a bad insult. I call it as an insult because he is not attacking everyone. I don't see why he is being rude to everyone.

Thirdly, where is the evidence of Darian attacking Cjay? 166.216.157.58 is the one who attacked Cjay. Wake up! I mean use your brain! Relating Darian and 166.216.157.58 without finding evidence is just something everyone should not do! This is so subjective in fact. I can say Rose is slandering Darian of saying that Darian is being rude to Cjay. Moreover, LOOK at the insult: "Kindly do the world a favor and quit leaking info about unreleased episodes and levels. Congratulations on figuring out how to read the game's source files: you've proven you have an IQ of at least 70, your parents must be so proud. PS: If you're only on level 470, why the f*** are unreleased levels that you might never legitimately reach in your lifetime of ANY concern ?" It shows no signs that 166.216.157.58 is related to Darian because they criticize others of different reasons! Darian is fed up with the underestimated difficulties of new levels but 166.216.157.58 is fed up with Cjay and Candycrush071 leaking info on future episodes. That makes the chance of Darian is the same as 166.216.157.58 very minimal. Then, blocking 166.216.157.58 for 2 weeks at first (finally to one month) and Darian for indefinite period would very unreasonable since 166.216.157.58's insults are much worse than Darian.

Fourthly, it's just jumping to conclusions that Darian wished no way to change his behavior on this wiki. Darian only made 2 rude comments in mainspace, while these 2 comments don't necessarily relate to each other. The first comment can be considered disrespectful, but the second comment is quite controversial. He has a point in the second comment. Moreover, Darian tries to reply politely to Roseturnip's warning. What's the problem of it? I don't see why we have to jump conclusions immediately that Darian wished no way to change his behavior on this wiki. And by that does it mean that Darian has to submit to this wiki's regime? What has the wiki become?

Finally, detrimental users should only be considered when they do harm to the wiki. 2 rude comments and not very serious harassment don't do harm to the wiki. He is not even vandalizing, sockpuppeting or whatsoever. At this moment, calling Darian a detrimental user is ridiculous in my opinion.

In my very honest opinion, Rose's reply about "his claim that Darian is insulting him" to Darian is insulting and a kind of defamation. I will not open another thread saying abusing powers or admins slandering others because I would give a chance to Rose to reflect whether he has done his best to gather enough evidence to make a block to Darian. However, if I see any admins trying to block people without adequate evidence, I will not tolerate but to report your actions. Moreover, by calling Darian's comments are rude, that Rose's reply to Darian should also be considered rude because I can see direct attacking. He calls Darian "idiot" while Darian calls people "insane". Idiot is as rude as insane, so by saying Darian is rude, why don't you try to be polite? I want to say that it is embarrassing. I have searched the delete logs and contributions of Darian and not even a single item is deleted with affiliation to Darian. If you want to further justify that Darian should be blocked indefinitely, please provide me a link to his actions.

After blurting out everything I wanted to say here, please show your stance whether we should lift (remove) Darian's block. Right now, he has already been blocked for three days and it is definitely enough as a punishment if you think that Darian should be blocked. The severity of his actions is definitely very low. Before anything can develop, please decide it quickly. I know I'm going to get hate from someone, but this is what I'm really concerned about and I would not tolerate any unjust permanent block from happening.

'''And to Darian: It is disrespectful to call others insane because they don't find what you find if you mean that others are mentally deranged because of that. If you don't believe, look up at the entry I've provided above. Moreover, you did say that the developers should be fired. It is rude and cruel because losing a job is not probably something one would want. You need to know that "unnamed criticisms" are not always a fail-safe, that means it won't always give you no harm. My school once have students (they are the masters of ceremony in an event) being punished even though they do not criticize anyone directly.''' 